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Comments: 187 • Responses: 66  • Date: 

lliinnddsseeyy51 karma

What’s your plan?

fearwithloathing91 karma

At the moment about the same as anyone else: wait for the government to release more information about the collection points and how they work, collect drain water and borehole water and, mostly, hope we get some sweet, sweet downpour this winter.

Beyond that, flee.

lliinnddsseeyy19 karma

Where will you flee to? How can you trust the government’s information?

fearwithloathing44 karma

Oh boy, this has been a real fear for me for a while. Since the information being released has been sporadic at best and the work done has been incredibly unreliable, it's hard to say what to trust.

For instance, will they make us aware when there isn't enough water for collection points? Will it degrade to utter, dystopian chaos? Who knows. I'm scared to know, because as much as it's hard to digest the reality is that that is a possibility.

I'm lucky, feels horrible to say, but I do have places out of the continent, and in Africa too, to which I could seek refuge with family. My parents don't usually live here, and if worse came to worse I'd go to where they do live I think.

lliinnddsseeyy6 karma

If you have places you can go, why not leave now?

fearwithloathing30 karma

I've lived here my whole life, I study here, my home is here, everyone I know and everything I love is here. It's sorta easy to think about moving if you have to, but otherwise I genuinely adore Cape Town. I see myself starting my life somewhere else but it hasn't been something I've considered happening for a few years at least. I suppose it's just something you have to grasp and then actually decide to do, and, well, I think my family and I are just hoping it'll figure itself out so we don't have to, I'd also move with them. Stupid, maybe, but it is what it is.

SalishSailor8 karma

"just hoping it'll figure itself out"

Do you worry that this is how most people who have ended up in really horrific circumstances ended up waiting until it was too late?

fearwithloathing2 karma

Ohhhhhh yeah

Jeggasyn1 karma

Your username checks out; but in all seriousness, good luck. I and the rest of the world hope that mother nature comes through and provides.

fearwithloathing1 karma

Pretty much, wasn't the intention, just a comment on my glasses, but thank you for drawing my attention to it :)

And thank you! I believe in weather!

jensyfrenzy1 karma

When you say "winter", are you referring to the Northern Hemisphere's summer?

fearwithloathing2 karma

Yes indeed!

jensyfrenzy2 karma

Thank you for the clarification! I was hesitant to ask because I didn't want to appear ignorant, but that gives me a bit of relief that winter is only 6 months away instead of another year. Best of luck!

fearwithloathing2 karma

Of course! It is comforting to know, but our winters can also be like summers often, which isn't helpful at all. Thank you!

quiliup18 karma

How much bottled water do you have access to? Sounds like you can’t drink the tap water

fearwithloathing34 karma

There's still a normal stocked amount on sale in stores, though I'm pretty certain that'll all disappear really quickly when the taps are shut off. Many people are buying bulk water now as well as using collection points in advance.

The tap water is drinkable however, and isn't dangerous by any means, we just don't have much of it left.

IXI_Fans1 karma

Does your area use grey water for toilets/outdoor spigots?

grey water is 'clean-ish'... not potable, but not sewer water either. A lot of islands use it and I wish it was more of an option for everywhere, but that means new plumbing and sewers which is way to costly.

fearwithloathing2 karma

We use left over shower water to flush toilets now, we don't really have different plumbing for grey water unfortunately though.

Prettygoodusernm17 karma

Is the water shortage causing social upheaval? How do wealth differences affect response to situation politically? Are you sure you want to be there when the pipes go dry?

fearwithloathing19 karma

To some degree, yes. There's a huge debate about the people who are using too much water, and justifiably anger too, as well as just really overall fear. We don't know what's going to happen, we want someone to blame but more than that we want someone to just fix it. Unfortunately it's just a bit too late for that.

I think to some degree there is a cultural disconnect, many people from both incredibly wealth suburbs and also incredibly poverty stricken areas are just selfish about their water usage. The people who are wealthy in all likelihood are able to overlook the repercussions of their actions for everyone else, and those who are poor are in many cases not well educated or environmentally conscious. It's hard to say though.

I'm not sure. I've toyed with the idea but it's such a big change for something I guess I'm really just hoping will be okay in the end. I love my city, and I'm not ready to leave it in more ways than one.

Prettygoodusernm7 karma

Thanks, sorry you had to go first in the climate change drought lottery. Good luck.

fearwithloathing5 karma

I'm hoping we get some good numbers in the next year or so, but thank you.

HookersForDahl201715 karma

When is that alien coming back?

fearwithloathing19 karma

You mean the prawns? Not on my watch.

HookersForDahl201713 karma

Yes the prawn promised 3 years to restore that man to human

fearwithloathing20 karma

The prawn kept his promise, now that man is acting in shittier films

baked_ham5 karma

Hahaha despite being physically thirsty, your humor cup runneth over

fearwithloathing3 karma

I've gotta stay soul hydrated in this climate mate

Erenito1 karma

If you could drink burns you'd be OK.

fearwithloathing3 karma

cries in spanish

Balloonknuckle13 karma

How long have they had water use restrictions in place?

I live in South Australia and have dealt with water restrictions before, but not at a level of urgency like this. Its crazy how many people just see water as something that is always there, it can very easily go away if not used properly.

fearwithloathing10 karma

The ones I've been aware of have been in place for around 2 years now, but they only became severe around the end of 2017 and beginning of 2018. We're currently at 50L per person, per day. Which is pretty crazy if you think about the fact that a two minute shower is about 20L.

This has 100% made me infinitely more aware of how much we use and how much we really don't need to use. Unfortunately until you're faced with real consequences it's hard to see that I suppose. Pretty sad too.

femmishrobot12 karma

How did the restrictions on water use get implemented, and what were people's responses like? Does the City use other water sources besides the dam/river?

I'm planning to read more about this now, thank you for bringing it to my attention, it's just cool to have a first hand account!

fearwithloathing18 karma

At the moment the main implementation is incredibly relaxed, it's hard to really stop people from using something that just is always available, but the recent changes mean that overusing within certain brackets will result in increasing fines. Malls and restaurants don't have running water in bathrooms, just sanitisers, and don't serve water to patrons who aren't buying bottled.

People are only now starting to realise precisely how bad the situation is and are definitely scared, many are kinda in denial still and then there's that percentage who are just too selfish to reduce their consumption. It comes up in conversation every few minutes really, I'm panicking quite a bit but it's hard to really grasp what it'll mean to just not have water.

At the moment they're beginning to drill into natural aquifers in and around the city, they're also looking into desalination but there is word that that water may not be potable, our main dam is almost entirely dry by now though and is supplying (https://www.news24.com/Video/SouthAfrica/News/watch-live-drone-footage-of-theewaterskloof-dam-now-168-full-20180111 probably the best footage currently to see this).

I hope I answered those all enough, and of course, I think it's important for people to see what exactly can happen and is happening.

FarterTed8 karma

How do u feel about your government denying Israelis to come to your aid with their water reclamation technologies?

fearwithloathing3 karma

(shoutout to the ct jewish pop with this one) Annoyed as fuck about the lack of interaction there. I'm a strong believer in the Israeli desalination technology, despite its flaws, and have been for far longer than this drought. I'm not sure if they're refusing to work with them, but I do think they should be.

gbimmer8 karma

Just a question about all the race stuff I heard on the news from down there: is it as bad as they say? Has apartheid basically reversed?

fearwithloathing12 karma

Wow, this one's a pretty heavy question generally.

It's bad, but as someone who isn't exposed to it nearly as much I can't really speak on the topic in complete confidence. It hasn't reversed entirely, but there is racial tension, much of it directed at the white population.

On the other hand it's one of the most socially integrated places, in the sense that there are an exceptional number of different cultures and races intermingling and engaging one another positively.

We do have race issues, though, as well as governmental, social and criminal. It's hard to deny.

1xolisiwe1 karma

There’s also tension between South Africans and immigrants. There’s been incidents of xenophobia in recent months.

fearwithloathing3 karma

The worst xenophobia we experience is other African immigrants coming here for work. It's horrific actually. But yes there have been some tourist incidents, no more honestly than I'd expect for here though. I have heard of some disturbing stabbings recently though.

searanger628 karma

[deleted]

fearwithloathing14 karma

Damn the sarcasm hurts. The management of this issue is, sadly, a bad light on the country, but honestly Cape Town is an absolutely amazing place.

Gewehr981 karma

Is this a da/anc problem or just a general incompetence problem?

fearwithloathing1 karma

It feels like it's always a da/anc problem, but I'd say it's just been general incompetence, but also unpredictability

HB_SG6 karma

Is the tourism industry affected? I would assume a lot of tourists in their fancy hotels still take a long shower every morning?

fearwithloathing9 karma

So this is interesting. A huge part of our income is from our tourism and agriculture, both clearly pretty dependant on water. Our government is still urging tourists to visit for that reason and despite the lack of water and our tourism is, if anything, increasing.

Hotels and restaurants are making people aware of the need to not use water, but as you said I'm sure they're not nearly as careful about it and I'm sure regulation is incredibly hard.

lauren_camille3 karma

Wait what? I'm visiting Cape Town in July, is this a bad idea if I'm thinking of a luxurious vacay...

fearwithloathing3 karma

I'm not sure what to tell you, we won't have running water if the taps are off by then. It's still beautiful, but yeah you won't have the luxury of water. I'm sorry!

alhuntsyou1 karma

well, who needs water.

fearwithloathing1 karma

:| mfw no water

Aximill3 karma

Are there any neighbors/locals ignoring the problem? Some Californians continued to use a lot of water during drought conditions not too long ago.

fearwithloathing8 karma

Oh yeah, something like 52% of Capetonians are using more than the 50L pp/per day cap. People are shit.

Aximill1 karma

How are plants and animals taking the conditions?

fearwithloathing1 karma

Animals are alright, mostly because we still do have water. Plants...not so much. All of our green lawns are quite a bit browner

vatten-sisia3 karma

How did this come about? No rain?

fearwithloathing8 karma

Less rainfall over a few years, a drastic (I think about 50%, but I could be wrong) population increase, no one decreasing their water usage in time, so a lack of information and awareness, and government literally just ignoring the need for backup systems when they were made aware of the problem.

It's hard as fuck to predict rainfall and these kinds of crises, but we definitely could've had a backup system in place a few years ago and should have.

fantumn2 karma

Do you know of anyone who has been hoarding water? Do you think anyone would do that?

fearwithloathing3 karma

This made me laugh, mainly because my friend has been joking quite a bit about running water out and selling it back to people at an inflated rate. He wouldn't actually do this though.

I don't know of anyone, but I definitely know there are people who would do that. If there were less restrictions and I'd been able to plan in advance I would've saved water for now.

_epoch2 karma

Do you believe this has been caused because of mismanagement by a particular political party or was this an inevitable catastrophe because of the infrastructure?

I heard that post-apartheid politics in SA have been quite ineffective and racially tense, is there any truth to that?

fearwithloathing5 karma

Personally I think it's a complicated issue and it's more than purely mismanagement, as much as that is part of it. We've had an extreme increase in population and that has been a contributing factor to what is a general and widespread/universal problem, I believe, of gluttonous consumption of resources.

The government could've done more when they first knew this was going to be a problem. Our infrastructure would've permitted that, as far as I'm aware. But they didn't, because they're shits.

But other than that our region is and has been experiencing the fluctuation of weather, and a general lack of rainfall. Overall it's just so complicated and the harder thing to focus on is what to do now that it's happening.

Ineffective, to some degree and depending on where you look. We work on a system of parties running provinces. Some of the work in Cape Town by our ruling party is genuinely some of the best in the country, we have really amazing services and advancements. But there is racial tension, there always has been and will be for the foreseeable future unfortunately. A lot of people seem interested in this but it's so hard to get into the nuances when just trying to address this one issue.

dividebyzeroZA2 karma

I grew up in Cape Town and was a teenager through (imho) some of the best years (that optimistic period just after Apartheid while Mandela was President into the early 2000's). It's a helluva City and one of the most amazing spots in the world :)

I'll be heading back for a visit in March this year (yup, I sure know how to time things). Is there anything you would recommend I should keep in mind or prepare ahead of arriving? Or perhaps a good source of information to stay on top of what's happening from overseas prior to departing?

fearwithloathing1 karma

Molo/howzit/lekker(?)! Always exciting to see fellow South Africans here. The best period, really. Everything seemed so wonderful.

Glad to see you coming back for a visit, if even at the worst possible time! I'd say just think ahead to what might be best to keep with you in a waterless country. Sanitisers or wet wipes I suppose? It's so hard to plan for what you don't really know is coming. Hopefully the April cutoff date won't be brought back any more than it has.

You're welcome to message me if you'd like any ahead of time updates, but otherwise I'd just check reddit and/or facebook. We're getting a lot of our updates there.

mrblobby302 karma

Where in CT? I lived in Plumstead.

Move to the Garden Route. We get plenty of rain.

fearwithloathing1 karma

Yay more South Africans I don't feel so alone! I'd love to, the Garden Route is so pretty. But currently I'm in the Southern suburbs, pretty nervous to say where because this has blown up.

Is your username a reference to that scary character that Jack Whitehall is terrified of? That video makes me cry with laughter.

mrblobby302 karma

Southern Suburbs and the Deep South are by far the better parts of CT to live, unless you're some Camps Bay brat. I lived pretty much next to Constantiaberg Mall. I think its called Constantia Village now, or maybe it always was. Can't remember... Lived in Fish Hoek too.

Yep. I grew up in the UK in the 90s when he was a thing.

fearwithloathing1 karma

Definitely, Constantia Village indeed. I lived in Fish Hoek growing up actually!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97fw8xjB5u4

bperron2 karma

Do you think the rest of the world will have to pay attention to the way this unfolds because we cannot rely on your government to share their findings and protocols?

fearwithloathing2 karma

I think it'd be good for everyone else to pay attention to what is happening around the world and to be aware of what can happen, but honestly I'm hoping our government will be transparent in their dealings with this.

Owherro2 karma

Are you thirsty already?

fearwithloathing6 karma

I'm always thirsty.

But in all seriousness no, currently we still have running water. That will change in <90 days, when they shut off the water mains.

Owherro2 karma

Haha alright slighty better question then. Has this ever been a serious concern before this moment?

fearwithloathing4 karma

Haha, no worries. Not to this degree, no. We've been aware of the decrease in rainfall and dam levels for quite some time, but nothing has been done and it's never gotten to a absolutely no water point before now. Cape Town is one of the more developed African cities, in the sense that it's almost entirely first world, and in that sense it's hard to come to terms with actually not having water.

I'm genuinely afraid that people who can't get to collection points or pay for water could potentially die, poverty of course is something we do face more so than anywhere else.

Morgz7891 karma

Why are they shutting off the mains? (Might sound like a silly question) And then what will you do?

fearwithloathing1 karma

Not at all! No silly questions.

It's sorta complicated, but to simplify it when we reach 13% for Theewaterskloof dam, our main supplier, what's left will be gruggy and hard to filter. In that case what is able to be supplied will be supplied to hospitals and places that need water more than just households, such as industry.

When that happens we will be able to get 25L per person per day at these gated, metal collection points they've set up around the city. They're currently guarded by riot gear police officers, it's pretty intense.

Emblematic_1 karma

Hi, hope I’m not too late. I was in Cape Town in 2016 and was stunned by the level of private security, along with the road signage near townships that basically says ‘we the government don’t trust these people’. At the time I remember thinking ‘it’s not like they’re going to rampage down the freeways into the central business district’. Has the water crisis shifted or amplified this level of unease?

fearwithloathing1 karma

It's 3AM and I've been answering questions in the two sweet hours before they took my post down, so no not at all late!

If you're living in a more upperclass area it's super normal to have more private security, it's a normality in suburban areas too. I haven't noticed a shift in that particularly, but I have noticed some fear about having to queue basically with other people.

4gotOldU-name1 karma

Wait... Why TF don't you guys just put in a desalination plant?

fearwithloathing1 karma

They are currently working on that, but it seems as if the water may not be potable, and that aside it potentially may not be quite enough, soon enough.

Rogue1Syd1 karma

What about real estate prices? Do you see them coming down? Are new residential site constructions going on or do you notice are in some kind of hold?

fearwithloathing1 karma

I've thought about this a lot, in terms of relocation and selling property. They may dip, but ultimately that's something we'll have to observe over time. I'd assume it would halt, or at least get in the way of, current construction quite a bit.

mollygwillickers1 karma

You said they are drilling water wells... what are the aquifer resources there?

fearwithloathing1 karma

We have various aquifers around the city, I'm unsure of placements really but they are, as far as I'm aware, quite full. I'm not sure how much they can supplement our current lack however.

mollygwillickers1 karma

Even best case scenario drilling and placement of infrastructure would be a 2 year minimum project.

fearwithloathing1 karma

And therein lies the fear

mollygwillickers1 karma

I worked in Wyoming USA as a geologist drilling water wells, my company also bid on (but did not win) the contract to install the gathering lines from new water wells to a city in the NE corner of the state. I’m very curious about weather and climate changes across the world. How long has the area been under water rationing?

fearwithloathing1 karma

That's really cool! A real life geologist! Proper rationing only started this year, but last year there was a lot of push to use less water from before last year. We really should've been doing more sooner.

mollygwillickers1 karma

Good luck mate, I’d love updates on your situation over time.

fearwithloathing1 karma

I'd definitely love to update once we're onto actually having to collect water but I'm not sure where would be the best place to do that. Thank you!

mollygwillickers1 karma

Possibly r/weather? I’ll keep a lookout for subs that would be appropriate. As an interesting side note, my in-laws in Montana have a farm and all their household water comes from collecting precipitation off the roofs of their house/outbuildings. Do you have any handy stats for how much your average precipitation is and what it’s been the last few years?

fearwithloathing1 karma

We've personally been trying to collect drain water but, having just checked the tank, two or three weeks has yielded maybe 40L if I'm being generous and the water absolutely stinks. We currently haven't had rainfall, specifically good rainfall, for quite some time.

In trying to look for some stats I've found very little relevant or concise information, but I can say that the last two years have been very, very dry from even just personal experience. We don't get a lot of rain, especially this time of year, and we're not getting it anywhere near the catchment areas unfortunately.

nickfroman1 karma

What conditions led to such drastic measures needing to be taken?

fearwithloathing1 karma

Excessive consumption (I feel like I've had to say that one word so much), population increase, lack of proper planning for a disaster situation such as this and overall decreased rainfall in the area

CatOfGrey1 karma

So, putting my economist hat on here, I always start with the silly question about supply and demand and resources, in this case, water.

My question is: How do people pay for water? And, since this issue didn't happen overnight, how come the price of water didn't increase over time, leading to conservation, and alternatives, such as alternative crops (if agriculture is part of the question). Generally, learning about how people pay for water, and the differences in industry/business vs. personal use of water tell the story of why there is a shortage.

We, in California, generally manage water terribly, because agriculture pays cheaper water rates than residential water users (ordinary people), so there is less incentive for agri-business to make choices that conserve water (like not plant almonds and other 'thirsty' crops.) It's not that simple, but the pattern exists in many different ways.

fearwithloathing1 karma

Right now we're still using water bills per household. I think the demand for water and the unfamiliarity with not having it would make it incredibly hard for the city to up the price very much very quickly. However there are drought taxes applied to people who over consumed, and I think that's probably the closest we have.

As for water collection points, I'm not sure what the price is currently to collect, but there is a fee and I don't think it's too much for the relatively underprivileged to access. A good thing to note is we do have an immense poverty here.

In our case we also rely heavily on agriculture as a source of income and as far as I know that sector is not at all stingy about their water usage. It has been a source of much contempt for some time, from what I've seen.

You're right though it is very interesting from this perspective. Hard to consider when you're bathing with wet wipes though :(

Katieg2201 karma

I saw you mention you're hoping for rain--what's the forecast?

Ps--hoping everything turns out okay.

Edit--words

fearwithloathing7 karma

A little bit of rain at the moment but nowhere near the right catchment areas unfortunately. Beautiful blue skies and 90 degree (farenheit for the americas 30-35 celsius for all the countries using the RIGHT system) all day, every day. It's currently mid summer and our days are that on average.

The water is going to be shut off around April, or so it's been said, which is about the start of our rainy season, winter, and I'm hoping that then we'll see some increased rainfall. There hasn't been for a few years though.

Thank you so much, me too I'm super scared.

aaathomas1 karma

What are the sanitary concerns associated with taking such a short shower only every other day? Have you noticed any significant changes concerning this? A bit of a different question, but what about hospitals/clinics/medical offices? Are they allowed more water than the general population?

fearwithloathing2 karma

Surprisingly pretty few. You start to stink on day two, but you can use wet wipes in between and you're really not going to be struggling very much if you wash your face and wipe down other areas. We weren't reeeallly showering every day a couple years back so you can do it without being too gross or getting sick.

Hospitals aren't going to be shut off from the water main, medical practices and clinics might however.

bryanofeaston1 karma

How badly do visitors mispronounce rooibos, and how should it be said?

fearwithloathing2 karma

Probably more than I've noticed. Roy-boss (best way I can think to sound it out here and without going into how y'all say 'o'!) Rooibos is best tea.

onestickinthemud1 karma

1) How much water can you use? 2) Who regulates it and how do they enforce it? 3) Does it cost more than gasoline?

fearwithloathing1 karma

50L per person per day currently, they regulate it by household and if a property uses over a certain amount they fine the residents, not yet, but I'm pretty sure soon it's going to be very expensive if we continue at this rate.

Ddslayer61 karma

Damn, i always thought cape town was the nice bit of SA, guess it still has its hardships at durban and joburg, my grandad lives in durban and he said the load shedding and water cuts were hard but he collected rain water for other things, how did it get so bad?

fearwithloathing1 karma

It is! It still is! We're just having some...troubles. My staple response now is: less rainfall, increased population, bad government, shitty people using too much

Prints-Charming1 karma

It was really nice when I lived there in the early 2000s. Is it as much of a shit hole now as my old friends claim?

fearwithloathing1 karma

I think it's still beautiful, honestly. There are glaring flaws, but no I don't personally think it's become horrible since the early 2000s

Prints-Charming1 karma

I heard there are murders daily in the streets, homeless on every corner.

fearwithloathing1 karma

Wow, okay I'd say yes there are daily murders but it isn't something I've ever witnessed or is prevalent in the city so much. There is a large homeless population though.

Prints-Charming1 karma

So it really is that much worse

fearwithloathing1 karma

I feel like that's something you'd have to determine yourself. Crime rate went up with the population and so did homelessness, but so much is so much better than it was before

PropellerLegs-1 karma

You live next to the bloody ocean mate. So long as there's water in that you're fine. It's not hard to set up a small distillation plant.

And in a place with wind and sun you have great opportunities for dirt cheap electricity to run desalination plants. Are there any desalination plants there?

fearwithloathing1 karma

Hahahahaha, you overestimate Eskom, our electricity company and also a shitshow who are currently saying they may stop producing electricity for the next year unless they're funded by the govt.

We don't have so much clean energy either, sadly.

That aside there are unfortunately issues with desalination and the water being unfit for consumption.

HjorleifKnutson-1 karma

fearwithloathing1 karma

https://capetown2012.jimdo.com/slums/

I've never claimed that? There are plenty of informal settlements in South Africa and in Cape Town. This thread is dead though

Eleazaras-4 karma

What about Flint Michigan? Haven't they been without drinkable water for a few years?

fearwithloathing3 karma

I don't personally know much about this or how they dealt with it, any advice would be helpful actually, but I do know there have been poisonings, which means people were drinking and bathing in the water. We won't have water to drink or bathe in at all.

Eleazaras1 karma

I am honestly not attempting to be rude, but is there some reason that marine water could not be used for bathing?

I realize the lack of drinking water is catastrophic but why couldn't you bathe?

fearwithloathing1 karma

No, not at all. It's pretty hard to bathe in saltwater though, it's not really clean and it does horrible things to your skin over time. I'm sure people will turn to that but it isn't really as simple as taking a bar of soap to the beach I don't think.

HjorleifKnutson-6 karma

How many people in your country actually shit in holes or on the ground rather than in a toilet connected to a sewer system as good as or better than the ones the Romans invented over 2000 years ago? I'm asking because of the risk of using ground water from wells.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholera

fearwithloathing1 karma

Like, genuinely, not many I don't think. At least not in the city. I have never shat in a hole in the ground. I've never even seen one tbh. Our sewage system is about the same as any other major city.

Our ground water and well water is really clean actually because of the way the city is set up. We're on a mountain and the rainwater runs directly downward to the ocean. We have plenty of clean, drinkable rivers and waterfalls during the rainy seasons.

Crusty_96-10 karma

Why is your country such a shithole?

fearwithloathing14 karma

Shitty government mostly. Cultural differences between the west and, well, here. Shithole is so subjective though, not running to the standard of certain first world expectations doesn't make it a shithole. Poverty and crime, the two unfortunately linked phenomena, do. An immense history of oppression and utterly different ways of life are hard to simplify to "shithole"

GIDAMIEN-22 karma

So explain to me how a major city running out of water isn't a shithole?

fearwithloathing14 karma

Yeah, see that one's hard. It's hard not to think it's a shithole, I agree. But it's also hard to explain precisely why it's such an amazing place outside of this sort of thing.

Drought doesn't make the country itself bad. It means the people who were supposed to be dealing with it didn't do their jobs right and that there were other environmental factors we really couldn't control.

GIDAMIEN-10 karma

It's not the drought that's doing it. That's down to chronically shitty governmental mismanagement. So.. Yeah a shithole.

fearwithloathing1 karma

Well it sorta is. We've had record low rainfall and record high temperatures (40 degrees celsius) for the past few years as well as a HUGE increase in population.

There are shithole parts of this country, but look at what those actually are and try not to purely say that. It's a wonderful place in many ways.

balthisar2 karma

Ignore him. He doesn't know what a shithole is. Most of India is a shithole, while coloured (do you still use that word?) Indians in South Africa have the best restaurants there are, after the game restaurants.

Granted, the townships can be shitholes, but I think those are self-made.

fearwithloathing1 karma

It's okay, I've realized there are things harder to articulate. We do still use coloured, yeah. And yeah it's a wonderful, diverse place with amazing food so I'm not too bothered by Trump thinking it's a shithole.

balthisar1 karma

I ignore most of Trump's announcements (it's not Trump, it's just that my caring doesn't make a difference). Did he say South Africa was a shithole??

fearwithloathing1 karma

He said Africa was, it's become quite the meme

balthisar1 karma

Oh. I'm guessing he meant just certain parts of Africa, but he's an unpredictable twit, so who knows? FWIW, I've not been to all of Africa, but am absolutely in love with South Africa. And I say that having spent most of my time in Pretoria.

fearwithloathing1 karma

I think he just meant Africa, he's something.

Being a Capetonian I'm obligated to say you haven't been spending your time in the right place and should visit Cape Town, it's so much more exciting!