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T42Rush2 karma

it is largely being replaced by a culture of vaping

and its happened quickly in just the last few years, same with something like the smart cell phone or streaming on smart TVs - but is it a bad "epidemic" or should it even be called an "epidemic" at all if its a smarter move ... maybe smart-cigarette use instead?

yes it is happening the quickest with younger adults that embrace change more readily ...as I've thoroughly combed thru the NYTS and MTF data and seen where while underage have tried it(reporting their use as mostly 1-2 times a month, and 1-10 times in their whole life) it appears that full time college male students of legal age are the biggest group of new vapers showing the fastest uptake - using vaping more steadily than underage - do we have concern for this group if they are prodomitaly not picking smoking of tradisional tobacco cigarettes as much as the same age group who are not enrolled in full time college? as I never see any focus in media or by agences that has an issue with them, where I feel this is when people develop and secure their lifelong habits, even tho most smokers(now vapers?) might have tried it in high school, they don't all become dependant until college years - what are your feelings of this group(males in college) if they are also the most influential to the future of smoking/vaping and also to the other age groups around them that might be lead by their change?

T42Rush2 karma

yes....the numbers I saw said that vaping both nicotine and THC is more prevalent in college males than any other group ...while non-college of the same age smoke twice as much, and there was little difference between college females and those who don't attend

college males are at the most risk for TThICC(as I like to say it "thick" for Tainted THC Illicit Cart Crisis instead of a more general Vaping Illness or whatever the CDC named it to point at all vaping .. VAPI ?) as its the thickeners used to cut the THC so it appears real

T42Rush1 karma

1.Ban the sale of all tobacco products, including both e-cigarettes and real cigarettes, to stores that are only open to people 21 years and older

I think the "and real cigarettes" limited to age restricted stores is a point many vapers and others miss ...it makes no sense to limit the harm reduction to all users(including youth) while leaving the known deadly products more easily available ... I have doubts you could remove tobacco cigarettes from behind the counters of all common stores tho, so this plan would backfire if not implemented completely for all tobacco products

  1. Restrict the level of nicotine in e-liquids. You don't need 54 mg/mL of nicotine in an e-liquid for smokers to succeed in using the product to quit smoking. In the UK, they have a limit of 20 mg/mL and data show that it is extremely effective in helping smokers quit.

they tried this with cigarettes already, and found that people just smoked more, increasing long term negative effects; what if vaping later is discovered to have long term effects from using more VG/PG and flavoring and not necessarily the nicotine concentration, which at higher levels could/should be vaped less? .... someone in the UK is just as dependant on a total 100mg nicotine intake daily as someone in the US using the same daily amount, but in the UK you have to vape 5mL of e-juice to get that, where in the US you only have to vape 2mL

so this is also a plan that could completely backfire, as the concentration of nicotine per mL has nothing to do with the strength of the hit; what determines how much nicotine and vapor is taken in is the device ...in the UK they use notably more powerful devices than something like the little Juul's popularity in the US; it might be that US smokers wanting to switch also want to get rid of the obnoxious clouds of smoke/vapor along with the other bad aspects of smoking, and be more discreet - where that might be less of a concern or problem in the UK, if vaping is accepted more openly ...and anyway, its long been known that smoking cigarettes do contain these higher levels of nicotine; so this might not work as well for heavy smokers, and could be a deciding point for new users who might then choose cigarettes for that initial stronger effect - aren't these the people of greater concern than the hobby vapers?

Konstantinos E. Farsalinos covered this back in 2014 when there were only smaller lower powered devices available https://www.nature.com/articles/srep04133 now some vapers('cloud chasers') have much higher watt devices so they don't require the higher % of nicotine...but what about the rest of us(a larger group in the US as shown by the greater numbers that use Juul over any other product here) that don't want, or can't use DTL devices; and do want something comparable to a cigarette hit, function, size, and effect but maybe with even less cloud opposed to more ?

  1. Regulate the safety of the product. The FDA should issue safety standards for e-cigarettes. This direct approach makes more sense than the current prohibitionist approach which is going to decimate 99% of the e-cigarette market by requiring expensive applications that only the tobacco companies can afford.

yes, for most of the recent growth of vaping, the existing regulations from 2009 and 2016 were ignored because they were not enforced; so this allowed vaping to grow wildly out of control like a kid set free in a candy store... those regulations should have been followed or changed back then, before things went amuck .... now I see most of the industry will be taken down, and have to be rebuilt following better guidelines - as much as I hate to see that happen, its inevitable

• overall I just don't think there are easy answers like these to the 'problem' and I think its more important to better define actually how big is the problem really; and then decide appropriate and smart effective action ... which should be the simplest and most direct involvement as possible to not totally upset any natural balances that occur •